Lore talk:Magnus Septim

Race

Since Pelagius III is known to be Breton per his appearance in Skyrim, I think he'd have to get that race from his father. Sources give him two different mothers, but neither are Breton, with one being an Altmer and the other being an Imperial. Such father-race inheritance isn't unheard of in TES, other known examples include The Anchorite, Tobias, and Virkmund. I realize I may have missed something here, hence the talk page.

This would mean Magnus had to be Breton for Pelagius to get the race. I wouldn't go so far as to say this would confirm Potema's race too even though she shares the same parents as Magnus as it isn't definitive whether siblings of the same parents can be different races. Mindtrait0r (talk) 15:03, 9 November 2023 (UTC)

There was a suggestion in Madness of Pelagius that Pelagius (and by extension his father Magnus) were Nordic

"On the orders of Magnus, Pelagius was married to the beautiful heiress of an ancient Dark Elf noble family, Katariah Ra'athim.

Nordic kings who marry Dark Elves seldom improve their popularity."

As for the supposed Altmer mother, at the time of Daggerfall when the book was written, the Direnni family were considered wholly Breton in race so the implications of him having an altmer mother were never really a factor. I don’t think we have enough to say Magnus was a Breton, should be removed imo. Dcking20 (talk) 21:14, 24 November 2023 (UTC)

Great point on that Breton Direnni thing. However, Ted Peterson did state that Pelagius' mother wasn't the Direnni one. Recognizing that is a UOL statement, how does that factor in? As for that Nordic thing, since we know Pelagius was Breton I think it can be safely assumed that 'Nordic kings' referred to him being a king in Skyrim, not of Nord stock himself. Mindtrait0r (talk) 02:16, 25 November 2023 (UTC)

Yeah I’m definitely in agreement that Pelagius himself is Breton given I think the Skyrim depiction is a solid enough source. More so just giving the source for completeness sake in regards to maybe or maybe not applying to Magnus, but yeah even that is loose and without anything too definitive it should probably just be "man".Dcking20 (talk) 04:21, 25 November 2023 (UTC)

Interestingly, there is precedent for UOL races on pages where none is available in official lore. Lore:Duadeen does this, listing him as Man/Akaviri, attested to by two UOL citations. Per the UOL Time and Place inconsistencies – The Imperial Library, Pelagius' mother is Hellena, who is Imperial per Wolf Queen I think. Mindtrait0r (talk) 22:18, 29 November 2023 (UTC)

True but with Duadeen we have no sources that conflict with the race given in Uol, I’d argue Pelagius' race in tes 5, and the original source that says his mother was a Direnni which at the time would have been considered Breton are two points in favor of the mother being the Breton. The Ted uol source and the Wolf Queen source are points in favor of her being the imperial. Either way I’d say it’s a conflicted matter. Dcking20 (talk) 22:24, 29 November 2023 (UTC)